one world, one currency

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Good idea?

Yes
8
38%
No
11
52%
Ik wil de gulden terug
2
10%
 
Total votes: 21

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The Rider Of Rohan
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one world, one currency

#1 Post by The Rider Of Rohan » 12 Jul 2009 12:45

What's next.. republic credits in ten years?

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Re: one world, one currency

#2 Post by Gandalf de Grijze » 12 Jul 2009 13:13

I think it is a good thing to have one independent currency for international trade. It is too early to have one world currnecy for everything, but a sortof virtual currency for trade would be a good thing, i reckon it would be more stable than any countries home currency.
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Re: one world, one currency

#3 Post by Beren Ercharmion » 12 Jul 2009 13:41

in generall some kind of world currency would be great, the euro for eample worked out pretty well, but I don't think it would work now, and I highly doubt that it will work in the future. Too many diferent interest in every country. It might be quiet easy o do something like the Euro with all the european countries, wich are rather similar, both in social and economical ways, but it mihgt be much harder to get countrys like germany and Cambodia together.
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Re: one world, one currency

#4 Post by End Of An Era » 12 Jul 2009 13:54

like most plans; in theory it does sound great, but practically not do-able.

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Re: one world, one currency

#5 Post by Joost » 12 Jul 2009 14:09

Two words:

Gold standard.

Not doable? It's just a matter of time before some country (be it Russia, China, or any other country) says "Hey, that old idea from centuries ago perhaps wasn't too bad after all, let's peg our currency to gold!".
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
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Re: one world, one currency

#6 Post by End Of An Era » 12 Jul 2009 14:15

Joost wrote:Two words:

Gold standard.
hey, that's a damn good point actually!! why develop a worldwide currency when we have the gold standard??

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Re: one world, one currency

#7 Post by West Virginia Mule » 12 Jul 2009 14:16

We should trade in bottle caps like they do in Fallout 3.
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Re: one world, one currency

#8 Post by Joost » 12 Jul 2009 14:21

Perhaps a return to something like the Bretton Woods system that existed between 1946 and 1971 isn't too bad either. Of course that system wasn't perfect either (if it were, it would still be existing now), but it should be noted that in those 25 years, there weren't any large-scale financial crises, and the system seems to be better and more solid than the currently existing system.
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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Re: one world, one currency

#9 Post by The Rider Of Rohan » 12 Jul 2009 15:37

Can't we just do something like in Red Alert? Build an ore mining facility gather huge amounts of money, then blast the bejeesus out of the other nations?

Works for me. 8)
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Re: one world, one currency

#10 Post by Sarah » 12 Jul 2009 17:07

Beren Ercharmion wrote: ... but it mihgt be much harder to get countrys like germany and Cambodia together.
I LOVE your example !! I know it's not representative of the rest of fhe planet but the me tion of cambodia might misplaced here : the whole country uses us $ and no atm will give you a choice. It's dollars and not even the alternative to have the local currency, which is usually mostly used for change money !
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Re: one world, one currency

#11 Post by Skyclad » 12 Jul 2009 18:25

We should all be using Professorland Funbucks. I myself call U.S. dollars Paganbucks.
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Re: one world, one currency

#12 Post by Joost » 12 Jul 2009 18:27

Now, "In God we trust" doesn't sound very pagan to me. :P
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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Re: one world, one currency

#13 Post by End Of An Era » 12 Jul 2009 22:13

Joost wrote:Now, "In God we trust" doesn't sound very pagan to me. :P
I am not a fan of the term, and this is the first time i use it, but Skyclad, you've been 0Wn3D!

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Re: one world, one currency

#14 Post by Skyclad » 13 Jul 2009 00:39

End Of An Era wrote:
Joost wrote:Now, "In God we trust" doesn't sound very pagan to me. :P
I am not a fan of the term, and this is the first time i use it, but Skyclad, you've been 0Wn3D!
Uhh... I think you guys failed at seeing why I personally call our money Paganbucks?
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Re: one world, one currency

#15 Post by End Of An Era » 13 Jul 2009 09:15

oh... :? then, please explain! :)

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Re: one world, one currency

#16 Post by West Virginia Mule » 13 Jul 2009 20:46

My initial reaction to the concept of one word currency, one world government, one world order, any of that kind of stuff, is one of aggressive dissent. However, the future I’ve imagined with Roddenberry’s Star Trek and its many wondrous children makes me believe it’s possible my thoughts are the products of an antiquated mode of perception. It’s like swimming from one pool of water to another through a long, water-filled tunnel. You look at that tunnel and think no, there’s no way I can hold my breath long enough to reach the other side. It’s terribly conflicting to believe in Roddenberry’s vision and yet feel that to yearn for that goal makes me a traitor to my own beliefs and my own country.

Well, you know, we’re not ready for any of that stuff yet anyway.
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Re: one world, one currency

#17 Post by The Rider Of Rohan » 14 Jul 2009 20:25

But then again, why couldn't it happen? Take the five biggest regions (USA, Canada, Russia, China and the EU) and combine them, and you've covered 35 percent of the inhabited part of the world. This is in square kilometres, mind you, but I'm sure you'll get roughly the same number when you look at the population. I'm guessing that in one far of day it isn't that unrealisitc to have one supranationalistic government, with regional governors for the different territories. And although I don't think most (or all) of us will live to see such a world would be born, I wouldn't be surprised if the next big step would be to have one world-wide currency, a step that we will possibly experience ourselves.

Is it far-fetched? I wager as far-fetched as the American colonies gaining independance from England.

Now, the thing that will crack my mind later this evening: would peace in the middle-east be a condition for a global government, or would it be a result?
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Re: one world, one currency

#18 Post by Gandalf de Grijze » 14 Jul 2009 23:26

considering that china already has about 33% of the world population, the chinese currency is already used by a significant part of the population :P
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Re: one world, one currency

#19 Post by Joost » 15 Jul 2009 00:58

The Rider Of Rohan wrote:But then again, why couldn't it happen? Take the five biggest regions (USA, Canada, Russia, China and the EU) and combine them, and you've covered 35 percent of the inhabited part of the world. This is in square kilometres, mind you, but I'm sure you'll get roughly the same number when you look at the population.
Except that Canada has less than half the population of Germany :P, and only 20% the population of, say, Bangladesh.

China only has 20% of the world's population, btw, but add India and you're already at 37%.
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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Re: one world, one currency

#20 Post by West Virginia Mule » 15 Jul 2009 01:48

President Obama spoke of a one world order kind of thing in his Cairo speech, with the "no one nation should be above another" comments. And you know, if Barry wants it, it's gotta be a good thing. We won't be using U.S. dollars because they'll have completely collapsed by the time he rolls out his fourth or fifth ineffective stimulus.

I wonder, really, if "no one nation should be above another" then how we do—had we the inclination to do so—go about achieving such goals? Create a world government somewhere (Atlantis, maybe) and “redistribute the wealth” possessed by the world’s population evenly across all peoples and nations? And then what? Once the great leveling has been done, how do you keep it level? Cultures and nations are so diverse that certain groups are always going to go places other are not. Maybe a forced reseeding, a redistribution of the population so that all types of people are located in even numbers in all locations across the planet? Everything equal, everything even, a smooth grading across the surface of earth.

How did they do it on Star Trek? Really, Star Trek should be our blueprint for the future. It works out much better than any of the other options.
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Re: one world, one currency

#21 Post by Joost » 15 Jul 2009 02:37

West Virginia Mule wrote:I wonder, really, if "no one nation should be above another" then how we do—had we the inclination to do so—go about achieving such goals? Create a world government somewhere (Atlantis, maybe) and “redistribute the wealth” possessed by the world’s population evenly across all peoples and nations? And then what? Once the great leveling has been done, how do you keep it level?
Gosh, why so complicated? Are you a communist or something? :lol: ;)

I think you are looking for way too much behind the "no one nation should be above another" statement. What is intended with that to me seems to be merely a gesture, a gesture to treat other countries as your equal, rather than as a potential threat and danger, no matter what.

And, like it or not, equality is still one of the cornerstones of the constitution of your country, and the Founding Fathers who wrote it. They based your country on the concepts of liberty and equality, and not on despotism by corporations and oil companies, or on warmongering with the rest of the world. But well, if you insist... I can provide you with some quotations:
George Washington wrote:Observe good faith and justice towards all Nations; cultivate peace and harmony with all.
George Washington wrote:Nothing is more essential, than that permanent, inveterate antipathies against particular Nations, and passionate attachments for others, should be excluded; and that, in place of them, just and amicable feelings towards all should be cultivated. The Nation, which indulges towards another an habitual hatred, or an habitual fondness, is in some degree a slave. It is a slave to its animosity or to its affection, either of which is sufficient to lead it astray from its duty and its interest. Antipathy in one nation against another disposes each more readily to offer insult and injury, to lay hold of slight causes of umbrage, and to be haughty and intractable, when accidental or trifling occasions of dispute occur. Hence frequent collisions, obstinate, envenomed, and bloody contests.
George Washington wrote:Harmony, liberal intercourse with all nations, are recommended by policy, humanity, and interest.
Thomas Jefferson wrote:When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
Benjamin Franklin wrote:There never was a good war or a bad peace.
It's weird how 'liberal' has almost become a curse word in some circles in the US, whereas the American constitution is almost a perfect embodiment of liberalism in its true sense (more so than the constitution of just about any country, I daresay).

All in all, I would also say that Gene Roddenberry has a hell of a lot more in common with those founding fathers than Rush Limbaugh, or any of his ilk. If you wonder about the philosophical/intellectual background of all of this, read up about liberalism and how it relates to the Enlightenment and humanism, and ultimately to the origins of the United States as a country. Obama does not betray any of this. On the contrary, he's probably a better embodiment of those founding ideals and dreams than any other recent president of your country has been.

And how did they do it in Star Trek? History seems to show me that daring to dream, and daring to believe in a positive vision of the future is the strongest motivator to make change actually happen, and I wouldn't be surprised if that's how it went in Star Trek, too. Desperately and inflexibly clinging on to the old and tried ways, on the other hand, tends to be the way of crumbling empires. And, the way I see it, with America – and, really, all of the Western world, it still can go both ways. Which of the two will turn out to be reality, is probably in our hands.
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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Re: one world, one currency

#22 Post by West Virginia Mule » 15 Jul 2009 11:11

Jeez, Joost. Don't lay it on so heavy. Hittin' me with the founding fathers? Heh. I've seen the same founding father quotes used by both sides to opposite effect. What's a confused, dimwitted dude like me to believe? I'm having a bad week. A bad month. Hell, a bad life. Heh.

The suddenly-feverish political interest has entirely sapped me of energy. Maintaining that level of awareness and, you know, outrage is just all-consuming. I was flatlining for a week or two, but am maybe starting to twitch again now. I dunno.

Uhm...it wasn't so obvious then that my idiot "everything equal, everything even, a smooth grading across the surface of earth" comments were stating the opposite of what I believe? I know, I know, I fail at straight debate again. It’s a tactic I take to differentiate myself and to camouflage weakness. All I can do is snipe around the edges, as I don't have the time and resources to commit to a full frontal assault. Seriously, with the 60-84 hour summer work weeks and the kids being home for the summer, about the only time I can type on this or any forum is from my cell phone at work. Not very conducive to anything, really.

I'll get back to you on this...probably...maybe...heh...but to sum up, no, I do not believe in the concept of world currency, world government, one world rule at all. I think it's...uhm...evil, for want of a better term. Heh. But yeah, a very dreaming, almost childlike part of me can see beyond the veil at what an ideal world might look like if we could evolve into it, and that’s the Star Trek vision. In that world I would be a villain fighting for the old ways, holding us back from the stars. But I don't believe we're anywhere close to such an evolution and doubt if it's even possible, and I certainly don’t believe that Barry Obama is the one to take us anywhere but straight to hell.
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Re: one world, one currency

#23 Post by t.a.j. » 15 Jul 2009 11:42

I don't quite see how better health care and education, more responsibillity for the rich and less warmongering can seem so threatening to you. You are de facto part of an interest group that has the most to gain from a leftward swing in US policy, yet you insist stubbornly to support those strata of your society that seek only to profit from your misery, both politically and economically.

It's like an old slave who, after being given a walking stick to walk away from his life of slavery hands it to his master to beat him with.
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Re: one world, one currency

#24 Post by West Virginia Mule » 15 Jul 2009 12:25

Tom! I was hoping you'd sit this (hopefully transient) political episode of mine out. :(

Anyway.

Nothing Obama has on the table is going to do anything but diminish or even destroy my life. Me and millions upon millions of others just like me in middle America.

I’m not a slave. I choose to work where I do with the full knowledge of what the job entails as far as hours, stress levels, personal danger and personality conflicts go. I absorb these things, albeit oftentimes gracelessly, because I’ve chosen to stay home in West Virginia where we’re all poor as dirt, and this job enables me to provide a decent lower middle class existence for me and my family. I could probably get a job sweeping a parking lot 10 hours a week for minimum wage, but I choose not to reduce the quality of life we have in exchange for more free time. To do something I might actually enjoy, something with the written word, for example, would involve first getting a piece of paper that says I’m qualified to do so and secondly a move to a different location. It’s really not an option anymore, if it ever was since 1997. In any case, these are all choices I make, how I choose to live my life. Freedom. If I want to eat 50 cheeseburgers and milkshakes a day, own ten Hummers and keep them running 24 hours a day, and I’ve earned the resources to make that possible, then I can do it. Freedom. Until the government passes a law making those things illegal, it’s none of their business what I do. But yeah, Barry O is going to do just that, no doubt. It’s all about eliminating my ability to choose and about giving him the ability to control. I choose to work at a job that creates a degree of personal problems to provide a certain measure of wealth for us because money really does equal happiness. Without money and the ability to self-sustain, there is no pride in existence. I felt it when I was unemployed and living on government unemployment checks—shame, embarrassment. Expendable income is what makes the free market spin, which is why Obama’s trying to take it away from us, so we all have to suck on his holy tit instead of feeding ourselves.

Socialized healthcare benefits me in no way whatsoever, yet it will harm me in countless ways. We have good coverage, coverage we’re happy with. Obama’s plan will ultimately destroy employer-provided private healthcare so we’ll all be forced once again to lean on Uncle Barry. If the horror stories about government healthcare in other places I’ve read are true, then we’re in for a world of hurt. Yay, it’s free! Only thing is, the good doctors are gone because they’re getting paid like janitors and oh, so sorry, there’s a two year wait for anything. But it’s free! Thanks, Barry, but no thanks.

Of course, if He bribes and threatens Congress enough to pass Cap and Trade, I’ll be forced to seek out the giving hand of Washington, D.C. too. Waxman-Markey does nothing to help the world’s environment, but it does a lot to put more money into Barry’s pockets and to help oil imports from China and India rule the United States. Stimulate the economy by forcing three million a year out of work, yay! Keep printing more and more money that helps nobody, collapsing the dollar. I wonder, in his 4th or 5th term in office, if Obama will still be blaming Bush and the 200+ previous years of shameful United States history for everything he feels is wrong with Mother Earth and its infestation of humanity.

Well anyway, good news for you guys, as I’ve said. We’re going for that even, level, one world government by first self-imploding, by breaking our own legs, so that we can bring ourselves down to the level of a third world country. That’s leading by example, change we can all…yeah, that. Heh.

Now I can’t keep doing this. Takes too much time. I have to take our new puppy outside to poop.
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Re: one world, one currency

#25 Post by Joost » 15 Jul 2009 12:44

West Virginia Mule wrote: I’m not a slave. I choose to work where I do with the full knowledge of what the job entails as far as hours, stress levels, personal danger and personality conflicts go. I absorb these things, albeit oftentimes gracelessly, because I’ve chosen to stay home in West Virginia where we’re all poor as dirt, and this job enables me to provide a decent lower middle class existence for me and my family. I could probably get a job sweeping a parking lot 10 hours a week for minimum wage, but I choose not to reduce the quality of life we have in exchange for more free time. To do something I might actually enjoy, something with the written word, for example, would involve first getting a piece of paper that says I’m qualified to do so and secondly a move to a different location. It’s really not an option anymore, if it ever was since 1997.
Are you sure these are actual choices you have in your current life? When was the last time you had the feeling that you actually had any choice? Have you not been complaining that you were essentially trapped in your current situation, and there was no realistic possibility to quit your job and just start doing something else? That doing so would result in you being unable to pay off your loans, your house, etc., and essentially your whole life? You write it yourself in the last sentence: "It’s really not an option anymore, if it ever was since 1997." If that's true, how can you still be talking about a choice?
If the horror stories about government healthcare in other places I’ve read are true, then we’re in for a world of hurt.
Which horror stories? People in Sweden or France (and almost all of Western Europe, really) generally have higher lives and a higher life expectancy (which is pretty much the most tangible way you can measure the health of a country) than the United States. The WHO ranks the health care in United States as #37 in the world, with France topping the list at #1.

The healthiest country (with regards to life expectnacy) which is not a microstate, is Japan, which has two types of health care... called 'social health care' and 'national health care'. :P Oh, the horrors of the Japanese health system, where the average female reaches an age over 86 years old.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... expectancy


And just for the record, I'm not at all interested in a world government.
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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Re: one world, one currency

#26 Post by West Virginia Mule » 15 Jul 2009 16:37

Joost wrote: Are you sure these are actual choices you have in your current life?
Current life? No. I'm locked in because I'm an idiot. I'm locked in because this job pays a ridiculous amount of money compared to other local jobs and—due to my own idiocy—I’ve spent money years in advance of actually earning it. So I need it now to keep things afloat, and barely afloat at that. But then, you know, even my own acts of idiocy were choices—idiotic choices, to be sure, but I'm free to make them, and I’m paying my bills—as was the knowledge of what it was going to do with regards to my ability to seek other employment. Not that I'd probably want to anyway. I make $60-70K at a place that's less than five minutes from my house. All they ask is that I give them my soul. Seems like a pretty good deal to me.
Joost wrote:Have you not been complaining that you were essentially trapped in your current situation, and there was no realistic possibility to quit your job and just start doing something else? That doing so would result in you being unable to pay off your loans, your house, etc., and essentially your whole life? You write it yourself in the last sentence: "It’s really not an option anymore, if it ever was since 1997." If that's true, how can you still be talking about a choice?
See, now when you say I'm complaining...I hope you're not using personal stuff from NPS against me here on this forum. It's a different environment and there are things I bled out there that I would not here. Not now. But as far as complaining here about things, I probably was recently complaining about what would happen to my life if Obama closes down the American oil industry, about everything I'd lose. Reasons for that? Nowhere for me to go. Few if any jobs in West Virginia. Fewer still for someone with no degree and no provable, resume friendly skills beyond process operations at an oil refinery, which will not be in demand if we close because, if we do, so will most related industries. And as long as we're being personal, Joost, I have a very strong fear, a trilling wire in the blood kind of fear, that if this job disappears I will sink back into the Brain Shit™ that existed before 1996. The near-simultaneous events of the birth of my first child and landing the refinery job have, more than anything else possibly could, given me purpose and really given me a definition of my adult life, insignificant as it may be. And so yeah, 12 years on and I’m starting to show ill-effects physically from the long hours, the shift work, the pressures there, but I can't let it go.

I've been hoping that I can at least break even before Cap & Trade cuts me down in 2012, then start over somehow, somewhere, in a diminished kind of life. As a different type of person, I could view this as a chance at a new beginning, a chance to finally realize things left unattended, or at least attempt them. But I'm not that person. I see only the dark ahead, feel only the cold, the premonitions of being poor as we used to be in the worst years, the shame and embarrassment, events having unfolded to once against expose the gaping maw of cavity in this character.

The job I have people here would probably kill for. In fact, I'm sure some of them would. I'm like the kid who opened the candy bar with the golden ticket inside and got to visit Fat Willy's Chocolate Factory, only to discover what horrors lie within. Still, it's chocolate, more chocolate than I'd ever imagined I'd have after all the missteps, and I'm going to keep eating it.

"It’s really not an option anymore, if it ever was since 1997" - What that line means is that with the long, odd hours of shift work and the long, odd hours of parenthood I have no time to do any furthering of education that might get me something different out of life. But I knew the consequences of the choices beforehand, and so accept (oftentimes gracelessly and with childish, foot-stamping complaints as mentioned earlier) the handcuffs I find myself in. Making choices does oftentimes negate things, huh? Even not making a choice and letting things unfold on their own is its own kind of choice. I think I was circling around that idea in the Last Day in the City thing.
Joost wrote: Which horror stories?
The ones O'Reilly and Rush tell me, of course. About Canada. And whatever. Rush = gospel. Holy writ.
Joost wrote:The WHO ranks the health care in United States as #37 in the world, with France topping the list at #1.

The healthiest country (with regards to life expectnacy) which is not a microstate, is Japan, which has two types of health care... called 'social health care' and 'national health care'. :P Oh, the horrors of the Japanese health system, where the average female reaches an age over 86 years old.
Did I mention somewhere that I thought the U.S. had no problems with its healthcare system? Uhm...no, I didn't, although I personally have no problems with it. But nationalizing healthcare in the Obama way is a gateway for Barry to take total control of our lives, squeeze out every personal liberty in the name of health. Can't eat that! It'll make you unhealthy and a burden on the government's healthcare system. Can't drink that! Not healthy. Can't drive that car! Too risky. Can't sit on that couch! Can't have that TV! They make you lazy and unhealthy and a burden on the healthcare system. And don't exhale so much! You're exhalations are killing the environment.
Joost wrote:And just for the record, I'm not at all interested in a world government.
Not even one run by Splitfoot Osama Obama hisself? Oh, c'mon. That would be bliss and tranquility for all.
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Re: one world, one currency

#27 Post by Joost » 15 Jul 2009 17:00

West Virginia Mule wrote: But nationalizing healthcare in the Obama way is a gateway for Barry to take total control of our lives, squeeze out every personal liberty in the name of health.
But why? A partly-nationalized health care system (I don't even think Obama is trying to go for full nationalization) seems to work fine in many European countries. Putting it concretely: which freedoms do you have, that we ('we' meaning people in Western Europe in general) haven't? And why would those freedoms be taken away if moves are made towards a system more like that in Europe?
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But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
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Re: one world, one currency

#28 Post by West Virginia Mule » 15 Jul 2009 17:48

Joost wrote:But why?
Why does He want to take away our personal freedoms? Why does he want to do any of the things he plans on doing to the United States? To destroy it and rebuild it in His own image.

Least that's what the man tells me. You don't think Rush is trying to scare people like me away from Obama just for his own purposes, do you? Heh.
I don't even think Obama is trying to go for full nationalization
While back I saw a speech clip where he seemed to back off on that because of the resistance the concept is getting.
seems to work fine in many European countries. Putting it concretely: which freedoms do you have, that we ('we' meaning people in Western Europe in general) haven't? And why would those freedoms be taken away if moves are made towards a system more like that in Europe?
I can't answer any of that because I don't know how you live over there. I mean, I thought I did, I thought you were pretty much like us in most ways. Maybe not so much. I dunno.

I dunno.

I'm going outside to spray Roundup® on the neighbor's shrubs.
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Re: one world, one currency

#29 Post by Led Guardian » 15 Jul 2009 20:35

Won't you feel silly about your doomsday proclamations of Dictator Obama when he steps down form office in either 2013 or 2017? :lol:
'Nowhere has this renunciation of man's transience been more joyous or uplifting than in the medium of airport carpets.'

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Re: one world, one currency

#30 Post by West Virginia Mule » 16 Jul 2009 03:25

Led Guardian wrote:Won't you feel silly about your doomsday proclamations of Dictator Obama when he steps down form office in either 2013 or 2017? :lol:
Oh, I feel silly about most everything I say all the time. No one is more aware of my idiocy than I am.
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Re: one world, one currency

#31 Post by t.a.j. » 16 Jul 2009 07:33

Then why not change your thoughts to see wisdom where you now see foolishness?

And I did not say you were a slave, just that the metaphor fits.
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Re: one world, one currency

#32 Post by West Virginia Mule » 16 Jul 2009 15:58

Winter ain't christmas. :)
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Re: one world, one currency

#33 Post by West Virginia Mule » 21 Jul 2009 20:12

The Almighty, Kenyan-born American President Obama's Science Czar John Holdren seems to like a one world order, as he apparently wrote in some book of his:
Those plans include forcing single women to abort their babies or put them up for adoption; implanting sterilizing capsules in people when they reach puberty; and spiking water reserves and staple foods with a chemical that would make people sterile.

To help achieve those goals, they formulate a "world government scheme" they call the Planetary Regime, which would administer the world's resources and human growth, and they discuss the development of an "armed international organization, a global analogue of a police force" to which nations would surrender part of their sovereignty.
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Re: one world, one currency

#34 Post by Led Guardian » 21 Jul 2009 20:38

Obama wasn't born in Kenya, he was born in Hawaii. And Holdren wrote that stuff in the 70s. It's not very current.
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Re: one world, one currency

#35 Post by t.a.j. » 22 Jul 2009 02:48

Those plans include forcing single women to abort their babies or put them up for adoption; implanting sterilizing capsules in people when they reach puberty; and spiking water reserves and staple foods with a chemical that would make people sterile.

To help achieve those goals, they formulate a "world government scheme" they call the Planetary Regime, which would administer the world's resources and human growth, and they discuss the development of an "armed international organization, a global analogue of a police force" to which nations would surrender part of their sovereignty.
Very good.
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Re: one world, one currency

#36 Post by Bender B. Rodriguez » 22 Jul 2009 05:33

Led Guardian wrote:Obama wasn't born in Kenya, he was born in Hawaii.
every american with a fake ID was born i Hawaii :mrgreen:
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Re: one world, one currency

#37 Post by Metal Fan » 22 Jul 2009 07:50

So my ID is fake if I was born in Hawaii? LIES!!!
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Re: one world, one currency

#38 Post by No‘am » 22 Jul 2009 11:31

"armed international organization, a global analogue of a police force"
FULL FORCE!
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Re: one world, one currency

#39 Post by t.a.j. » 22 Jul 2009 14:06

every american with a fake ID was born i Hawaii
Metal Fan wrote:So my ID is fake if I was born in Hawaii? LIES!!!
here is your logic:

All A (american with fake ID) are B (born in hawaii)
I am B (born in hawaii)
---------------- Therefore
I am A (american with fake ID)

But I'm noooot! LIES!

And this is how your logic should be:

All A (american with fake ID) are B (born in hawaii)
I am A (american with fake ID)
---------------- Therefore
I am B (born in hawaii)

But I'm not A, therefore this whole argument does not apply to me.

See the problem?
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Re: one world, one currency

#40 Post by Sleeping Dragon » 22 Jul 2009 14:18

COBRAAAAAA! :twisted:
ᛁᚠ ᚣᚩᚢ ᚲᚪᚾ ᚱᛠᛞ ᚦᛁᛋ ᚣᚩᚢ ᚪᚱᛖ ᛏᚱ00!
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Re: one world, one currency

#41 Post by Led Guardian » 23 Jul 2009 01:54

t.a.j. wrote:
every american with a fake ID was born i Hawaii
Metal Fan wrote:So my ID is fake if I was born in Hawaii? LIES!!!
here is your logic:

All A (american with fake ID) are B (born in hawaii)
I am B (born in hawaii)
---------------- Therefore
I am A (american with fake ID)

But I'm noooot! LIES!

And this is how your logic should be:

All A (american with fake ID) are B (born in hawaii)
I am A (american with fake ID)
---------------- Therefore
I am B (born in hawaii)

But I'm not A, therefore this whole argument does not apply to me.

See the problem?
I think the problem is assuming A in the first place. :lol:
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Re: one world, one currency

#42 Post by t.a.j. » 23 Jul 2009 07:29

Led Guardian wrote: I think the problem is assuming A in the first place. :lol:

The logic does not care what silly contents you put in it.
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They say that life's a game, then they take the board away.
They give you masks and costumes and an outline of the story
Then leave you all to improvise their vicious cabaret...


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Re: one world, one currency

#43 Post by blind-man » 23 Jul 2009 12:08

implanting sterilizing capsules in people when they reach puberty; and spiking water reserves and staple foods with a chemical that would make people sterile.
Actually, that's not a bad idea. Quoting Mr. David Attenborough: "I’ve never seen a problem that wouldn’t be easier to solve with fewer people, or harder, and ultimately impossible, with more."
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Re: one world, one currency

#44 Post by West Virginia Mule » 23 Jul 2009 15:08

I'm all in favor of population control...as long as I am the one deciding who lives and who dies.

P.S. Everyone on this forum dies. Sorry about that.
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Re: one world, one currency

#45 Post by ThePKH » 23 Jul 2009 18:25

West Virginia Mule wrote:I'm all in favor of population control...as long as I am the one deciding who lives and who dies.

P.S. Everyone on this forum dies. Sorry about that.
Actually, all people eventually die because I decided so. It would be boring to live forever, wouldn't it?
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Re: one world, one currency

#46 Post by West Virginia Mule » 23 Jul 2009 18:40

ThePKH wrote: It would be boring to live forever, wouldn't it?
Eventually it probably would. I mean, various Twilight Zone and X-Files episodes make it seem so. But I'd like to try it for maybe a thousand years and make my own conclusions.
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Re: one world, one currency

#47 Post by West Virginia Mule » 23 Jul 2009 18:47

James Lewis of American Thinker wrote:Consider what happens in the Netherlands to elderly people. The Netherlands legalized "assisted suicide" in 2002, no doubt in part for compassionate reasons. But also to save money. There is only one money kitty for medical care in the socialist Netherlands. When you get old, the question is asked, either explicitly or by implication:

Do you deserve to live another year compared to young refugees from Somalia, who can use the same euros to have many years of life?
Is this really how it is over yonder, Netherlands dudes of this forum?
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Re: one world, one currency

#48 Post by Joost » 23 Jul 2009 19:22

West Virginia Mule wrote:
James Lewis of American Thinker wrote:Consider what happens in the Netherlands to elderly people. The Netherlands legalized "assisted suicide" in 2002, no doubt in part for compassionate reasons. But also to save money. There is only one money kitty for medical care in the socialist Netherlands. When you get old, the question is asked, either explicitly or by implication:

Do you deserve to live another year compared to young refugees from Somalia, who can use the same euros to have many years of life?
Is this really how it is over yonder, Netherlands dudes of this forum?
No. Although indeed euthanasia is legalized under very specific circumstances (there has to be 'suffering without any outlook of improvement', and often euthanasia requests are actually denied because this criterium is not fulfilled), questions like this are never asked, and I never even heard about money concerns playing a significant role in the legalization of euthanasia.

Just to name an example: my own grandmother, who always fought for the right to be in control of one's own life, and have euthanasia legalized under specific circumstances, always said that, when there wouldn't be any outlook anymore to do anything with her life, she would prefer to have euthanasia. Until she actually got a stroke, which severely impaired her brains, and . She couldn't get euthanasia because she was unable to actually formulate the request to do so, and lived on for a month longer than she probably would have wanted.

Also keep in mind that the amount retirement money people get from the government here is quite small, and most of the retirement money is money they have accumulated through (private) retirement funds. And those retirement funds aren't the ones giving any money to Somalian immigrants.
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
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Also, Balrogs have wings.

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Re: one world, one currency

#49 Post by Joost » 23 Jul 2009 19:26

There is only one money kitty for medical care in the socialist Netherlands.
Actually, health care here is privatized to a significant degree. People pay their own insurances and such, to private companies, not to the government. (Although there is a limited amount of money, which is okay for a limited insurance, but not a very comprehensive one, that people with a low income get from the government. But with that money, they still have to get themselves an insurance from a private company that is entirely separate from the government.)
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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Re: one world, one currency

#50 Post by Joost » 23 Jul 2009 19:29

Reading up on it: the health care system in NL is actually very similar to that in the US, where there are also possibilities like Medicare and Medicaid for people with low incomes. If the Netherlands are socialist in this regard, then so is the (pre-Obama) US.
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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